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Topic 13        Thu Jun 19, 1986
DEB [*deb!*]                 at 13:21 EDT
SUB: The *1581* Still Lives....             

The 3.5" Disk Drive announced by Commodore earlier this year will make it
yet!
7 message(s) total
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 1         Thu Jun 19, 1986
DEB [*deb!*]                 at 13:23 EDT

I thought I'd beat MIKE to the punch on this one, and make everyone's day
at the same time...!
  
The 1581 WILL come out.  Not in time for Christmas, which means next
spring sometime, but they have finished it, and its _not_ dead!!
 
   I've no other details, tho.  This from a friend at CBM who should know!
  
        *deb!*
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 2         Fri Jun 20, 1986
MIKEW1 [Mike W1]             at 18:17 EDT

THANK YOU DEB!!!!!!! <<mucho kisses your way!!!>>
And just to show CBM how happy I am, I plan to buy one of the first
1581's off of the line!!!  I may have to wait till next year to do it,
but at least I'll be able to!!
A very happy and apparently successful head of the National Save the
1581 Campaign,
        Mike Ward
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 3         Sun Jun 22, 1986
GBARRETT [VISION100]         at 04:23 CDT

     Here I am the wet blanket again...
     The CBM people are doing AGAIN what they did earlier this year...
promising to have the 1581 out...but don't count your 3 1/2 inch disks 
before they're hatched...marketing hasn't gotten this past the top brass
yet...who have to get banker approval for all the new stuff...so it's 
still not an orderable item!
      -I hate to be the cynic...but if we accept the officially drafted line 
which has been given to all employees to say in response to 1581 
questions:  
      "The 1581 is currently scheduled for production sometime after the middle 
of January" 
      ...then we're going to get our hopes up awfully high.  As a distributor, 
the product is not available to me for even advanced order
with official cost, retail, etc. and until they start taking pre-orders
I will remain the skeptic-not gonna have the "post-1572 depression" again!
-Gary
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 4         Mon Jun 23, 1986
DEB [*deb!*]                 at 22:38 EDT

Oh, I'm just pleased its not totally scrapped....but I never believe
ANYTHING is real until I can go buy it off the shelf....
   
    **
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 5         Thu Jun 26, 1986
MIKEW1 [Mike W1]             at 23:05 EDT

Gary,
  Oh, really, we understand... Trying to kill my baby!!! :sniff:
    <smile>
   As I've said here and elsewhere, don't just listen to me...WRITE...
it's the way to make sure you are heard.
   Not listening to me is a good idea anyway! hehehe ;D
Mike
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 6         Fri Jun 27, 1986
DEB [*deb!*]                 at 16:51 EDT

Hey....I REALLY would print out an entire thread here and ship it all
FOR us, if you guys want to...but you're going to need to remember
to:
  1. Use your real names
  2. Substantiate your existance in the real world with an address.
  3. Keep the comments from becoming hysterical or name-calling in nature.
  
     What say thee?
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Category 2,  Topic 13
Message 7         Fri Jun 27, 1986
MIKEW1 [Mike W1]             at 19:08 EDT

Deb,
Oh, I'll still pelt CBM with stuff myself, but if you want to send
out a thread...I can provide you with the necessary information.
       Mike Ward
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Topic 40        Thu Dec 25, 1986
SPARROW.J                    at 00:24 EST
SUB: 1581 PROTOTYPE ARRIVES ON MY DESK
     

Well Ladies and Gentleman I am pleased to announce that a pre-release
version of the 1581 3.5" disk drive has arrived at Twin Cities 128
for evaluation.  I will be happy to answer any questions on it!
19 message(s) total
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 1         Thu Dec 25, 1986
SPARROW.J                    at 00:35 EST

In the upcoming months, TC-128 will be covering the unfolding story
of the 1581 disk drive in a big way, but for all of you who are
curious, I will do my best to field your questions and clear up
any misconceptions about this new peripheral.  The prototype we
received is packaged in an Amiga 1010 case and is a near final
version of the operating system, with one notable exception..
Super-side sectors are not yet fully implemented for 800k
relative files.  With the drive we received photo-copied galleys
of the 1581 users guide and some very specific developers 
documentation.  Individuals on the engineering staff at Commodore
have told me that they feel this product should be ready in late
february/early march.  They indicated to me that so far the biggest
delay has been in the tooling of the plastic cases.  So far I have
 been impressed with the 1581's speed, quietness, and 
compatibility with existing commercial software.  As I delve
deeper into this prototype I will let you know what I find..for
now I'd be happy to answer any questions to the best of my ability.

--Sparrow James
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 2         Thu Dec 25, 1986
LEROSENMAN [Larry R.]        at 01:54 EST

Loren,
    Any CP/M for the 1581??  I heard rumors that they (CBM) had a 
potential problem with DRI over "Another version" of CP/M (licensing
and all that).
Any and all info would be appreciated.
Larry Rosenman
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 3         Fri Dec 26, 1986
M.H.FOSTER [mark]            at 17:57 CST

Sparrow:
     What is the word on weather
or not the 1581 is compatable with
the 1541/71's,I heard on that othersystem that it will not be compatable.
     If that is so how does C=
think they will sell any?.I know of several BBS's that are waiting for them.
I want to use one my self,but only
if i can use my 1541 and 71 also,as say drive  what ever...
 thanks for any info you can give.
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 4         Fri Dec 26, 1986
DEB [*SysOp*]                at 19:28 EST

Oh, Mark...the 1581 *has* to be system compatible!!!!!  They are working
overtime in making it compatible with EXISTING Commodore DOS commands,
so the unit appears just like any other CBM drive, but its MUCH faster,
and has a MUCH larger capacity! 
  
    *deb!*
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 6         Fri Dec 26, 1986
M.H.FOSTER [mark]            at 20:50 CST

hi DEB:
    I know it must be 64/128 compatable,but I heard(read-q-stink),the 1581
will not work w/1541,1571 and reads only mfm format.
if you want to know WHO wrote that
leave me mail and I will be glad to tell you...
mark
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 9         Fri Dec 26, 1986
SPARROW.J                    at 22:15 EST

Well Larry, unfortunately I received no software with the 1581 proto,
but I do know that they are planning on releasing a version of CP/M
for the 1581.  If there are any problems with DRI, I have not heard
of them, but I will check into it and let you know what I find out.
 
As for compatibility, the 1581 is DOS compatible with the the 1541
and 1571, meaning that the all of the operating systems routines
which are documented and supported by CBM are also supported as part
of the 1581's operating system.   The 1581, however is not media
compatible for obvious reasons (no matter how you try you are not 
going to be able to jam a 5.25 disk in that tiny slot).  In addition
the 1581's internal design is quite different than that of the
1571/41 so those software companies who wrote their own drive code
that is not supported by the standard kernel table will have some
work ahead of them.  The 1581 does use the MFM format but this does
not present any problems since the firmware takes care of the data
organization.  By making the 1581 an MFM format Commodore has saved
a ton on development and production cost so this drive can be both
fast AND affordable.  So far I have had no problems with software
working with this drive.
 
--Sparrow James
**
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 10        Fri Dec 26, 1986
GARYW                        at 21:35 CST

The 1581 does not have to be 1541/1571 compatable.  Would you want the 
Space-Shuttle to be Bi-Plane compatable?  But they both do a good job.
Not to worry. You will be able to dod more with a 1581 than a 1541/1571 any day. 
 I just hope they have some to show at CES.
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 11        Sat Dec 27, 1986
M.H.FOSTER [mark]            at 16:59 CST

First,didn't mean anything bad about Q-Link,second I want to use the 1581
with the 1571 as drive 9 or 10.I just wanted to find out if the new drive
will work with the others,say for copying to the new drive,dling text and
programs to the new drive,etc...
In reading what was posted on Q-Link i wanted conformation on weather or
not that information WAS correct.
I know of two BBS's in this area,that are waiting for the drive,and want
to be sure that it is workable with the other drives...
thanks..
mark
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 13        Sat Dec 27, 1986
M.H.FOSTER [mark]            at 18:45 CST

All right.
Thats all I wanted to hear.
thanks a lot Sparrow for the info,I know a few people around here will be
glad to hear that.Now all I got to do is save the money..
thanks again
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 14        Sun Dec 28, 1986
GRAFIX.M [Mike Hooper]       at 17:11 EST

Any idea if it will read other format disks?  (Amiga, Mac, IBM??)  Any
rumours of software being developed to do the reading if the drive does
not have the capability built in?
  \\GFX//
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 15        Sun Dec 28, 1986
TIGLON.G [*SysOp*]           at 19:09 EST

Weren't they boasting that it would read MAC disks?? [WHY I have no idea]
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 16        Sun Dec 28, 1986
JIM.MAC [* SysOp *]          at 21:59 EST

I was just thinking of something...(Thinking for me is a rare event!)
The 1581 certainly will not likely be the first drive a new Commodore
user buys.  They would have trouble finding software in that format.
So I would think that CBM must see it as the second drive purchased.
If the price is close to that of a 1571 I wonder if they will drop the
price of the 1571?  I can picture myself in the store planning to buy
a C=128 system saying. "I have to buy a 1571 first but it isn't as good
of a buy as the 1581... I am getting less for my money!"
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 17        Sun Dec 28, 1986
GARYW                        at 21:34 CST

Jim: There is truth is what you say.  However, they are both dirves, but they do 
different things.
Just like monitors. I much prefer my RGBI monitor to a composit monitor. And 
don't say get a 1902.  I have seen them and they do not compare to a good RGBI 
monitor.
I think the ideal system would be a 1571 and then a 1581.  But I still want a 
dual drive.
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 18        Mon Dec 29, 1986
SPARROW.J                    at 03:10 EST

As for "alien" formats, the developers docs suggest that IBM and Atari
formats should not be too difficult.  I am not sure about the Amiga
because of the unusual way things are organized on those pups.  I have
heard that Mac disks are not MFM formatted, but I am not sure.

As for the primary/secondary drive questions, that is an interesting
can of worms.  I think initially the '81 is going to be thought as a 
secondary drive only for larger storage requirements.  But I really
hope that a lot of people consider it, because it seems to me that
the more people who purchase them, the more likely it is that we
are going to see 1581 versions of commercial products.  As for a
price reduction in the 1571...I'm just not sure, the 1581 could have
that effect, but I doubt it since these are birds of a different
feather.

--Sparrow James
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Category 14,  Topic 40
Message 19        Tue Dec 30, 1986
GRAFIX.M [Mike Hooper]       at 18:38 EST

The Amiga will read IBM disks (with the right software driver) and can
be coaxed into reading most of a MAC disk.  The Mac drives change speed
as the changes tracks.  Well, if the info suggests it will read an IBM,
I suppose it would work with AMY disks too.  IF we can get drivers!
  \\GFX//
Guess I should worry about getting a drive first, huh?  ::grin::
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